How do I get started mountaineering? / Is mountaineering for me? [back to top] [FAQ contents]

From: Rob William

Week 1: Buy a carton of cigarettes, a case of your favorite genera of malt liquor, a nose-clip and a stairmaster. Consume all consumables/combustibles, place nose-clip on nose then begin workout on stairmaster at lowest setting until you puke (simulates AMS). Lather, rinse, repeat.

Week 2: increase intake of alcohol and cigs, rachet up stairmaster to nest highest level.

Week 3: see above. Repeat as necessary. Remind yourself that this is "fun."

Week 4: those thoughts of bouldering? Forget them. Its for wusses. Get back on that stairmaster. Suffering builds character dammit.

From: Ric Altman

When friends ask me how my last mountaineering trip went, I have a hard time using the word "fun" in my response.<g> A challenging, rewarding adventure maybe, but fun, I don't know.

From: Mike Garrison

There is no one optimum method of learning the basic skills of climbing. (By climbing I mean "mountaineering".) It depends on your needs.

I help teach a class which is relatively cheap and comprehensive, but requires a tremendous extended time commitment (one night a week and every weekend for about three months).

Commercial classes teach you much the same stuff in a single week, but you pay thousands of dollars more for that immersive experience.

Or you can learn the same skills over spans of years. Doesn't really matter.

What is important is that there are certain minimum skills you should know, and they vary for each type of climb you might be attempting. Mountaineering, Freedom Of The Hills is a very good general reference.

Once you have those minimum skills, the most important training is to get as much experience as possible by climbing as much as possible (though trying to be conservative enough not to get in over your head).

From: Darren S.

It really helps to have a big hill nearby, say 2000+ ft elevation gain with several trails for variety. If not, the stairmaster is a decent, but not perfect, substitute. To do well dashing up to 14,000ft in 2-3 days with a heavy pack, heavy boots + crampons etc, and not just barely survive utterly drained, you need to be in fairly exceptional aerobic shape. That is doable over 5 months. Something else you might want to look at is Mark Twights book Extreme Alpinism His training regimen, authough you would need to scale it for your needs, sounds right up your alley as well. Goes something like 6 weeks - 2 months building an aerobic base, then adding intervals, power workouts and some sessions near your aerobic limit. Twight also goes deep into diet, equipment issues, the psychology of climbing, and most importantly, tells some damn good climbing stories! :)

From: Michael Riches

Soooooo, what are your options??? I would try something a little closer to home and a little more doable for your first test piece....if you like dirt, sweat, the stench of days without bathing, clothes that soon take on a mind of their own, blisters, blisters on your blisters, constant fatigue, water that tastes worse, after being treated, then regular bowl water...food that tastes worse than the water, cold that chills the soul and demons that eat the life from even the strongest person, then you might ...just might... become a good alpine mountaineer...

Those small mountains (that should be visible if you live somewhere in the world except Ohio and Kansas) all have trails up, around and all over them...Try these (hopefully with somebody to share in your sufferings...this is important) and if you can honestly say you've had fun, then move on to the ones that are in the adjoining areas...branch out and climb as many different mountains as you can find...When the time is right, you'll be able to do your Kilimanjaro without wondering if you can or should...

From: Mike Garrison

Should I take any technical climbing lessons in the local rock climbing gyms before heading out to the mountain?

It won't hurt, but it isn't necessary. Almost every mountain can be climbed successfully by people who (like me) only have a low level of rock climbing skills. Note that does not mean every route on every mountain! The more rock climbing skills you have, the more options open up to you. The same is true of all other mountain skills (skiing, camping, snow climbing, ice climbing, off-trail navigation, first aid, etc.). Rock climbing is only one of many skills needed for mountaineering.

From: Kai Larson

Yes, you should take such lessons, but taking lessons in the local gym won't prepare you adequately for climbing in the mountains. Get someone with some experience to go with you, and be very very conservative in your initial objectives. Get comfortable at your local crags, then try smaller peaks, and slowly work your way up to the larger mountains. You will have more fun and will likely live longer if you take it slowly than if you try to rush things too quickly.

See also:

How do I get started climbing? on Tradgirl

What size shaft should I get for my ice axe? [back to top] [FAQ contents]

From: Forrest

Most folks use a 70cm Axe for general Mountaineering...  If you are shorter maybe a 60-65 would suit you.  I would go to the store and lean on a few.  See what is comfortable.  Most stores can size you up without a problem.

From: Dr Propane

The rule of thumb is to stand with your arm straight down your side, grasp the ice axe by the head, and the spike should rest somewhere around your ankle.  For severe snow angles, a shorter shaft will do. If you are planning to use the axe as a trekking pole as well, then go with a longer one, up to 10-15 cm longer than the above system would recommend.

See also:

Charlet Moser Guide Ice Ax on Google Groups(ignore scrambled posts at top; it gets better)
ice axes on Google Groups
Looking for the lightest Iceaxe available on Google Groups
Which ice tools should I buy? on Tradgirl

All avalanche questions [back to top] [FAQ contents]

General Resources

The Avalanche Center
Avalanche.org
University of Calgary Applied Snow and Avalanche Research

Recommended Books

Avalanche Safety for Skiers, Climbers and Snowboarders by Tony Daffern

Avoidance

Avalanche Awareness Tutorial
Eight Steps to Reducing Your Avalanche Risk

Rescue

From: John Brynes

You need to get a book or better, take a class. But in very few words:

Transceivers are always faster than probes alone.

People don't always end up where you think they should.

For deep burials (narrow often means deep), the rescuers need to be better trained.

Avalanche Basics from the National Avalanche Center

Information for the alpine rescuer from Avalanche Emergency

Tools

Avalung

From: Gary S.

You can save $200 and still breathe easily if you learn how to avoid being buried in the first place.

It's still thoroughly useless if you get injured during the avalanche. It's useless if the rest of your party get buried. It's useless if the rest of your group does not have the tools (beacons, probes, trained dog) to locate you. It's useless if the rest of your group doesn't have the tools (lots of strong, quality shovels) to dig you out.

All of this is useless if your group does not have the knowledge, skills, energy, and composure to get you out in time.

My concern is that this will encourage some foolhardy people to press on in high risk conditions. On the other hand, you'll be able to get an Avalung real cheap if you wait for the spring thaw.

From: Munckee

I agree that there is no substitute whatsoever for being knowledgable in the backcountry. I also believe, however, that we can't always predict correctly and that sometimes even the most knowledgeable people get caught.

From: The Rockrat

And when that happens let's hope that the rest of the team is quick enough and skilled enough to find you before you have to put that misguided faith to use...

( personally I'd spend the 200 bucks on a good avy course and a few "usable" tools like a shovel, probe and beacon...)

From: Sue Hopkins

yup and after that If I have to do AC in a ski area, or I have to heli guide in the back country, or I otherwise have to place myself at increased risk for some reason, I'd have an avalung. You can know all you want, and be careful all you want, and dig the pits, etc. and sometimes that slope is just going to go whomp, and for whatever reason you may be cought.

Its another tool like a beacon, like a probe, like a shovel. 200 bucks is a reasonable price for something that really works. Mike get the data and have a look at it. The research was done by a scientist (and climber BTW) who I really respect. The data are VERY impressive. I'd put the money I saved by not buying a $400 pulse ox, that most people are going to know what to do with information they get anyway, or if they do know they could have made that decision on clinical grounds and buy an avalung.

Avalung (it's a crap web site but a nice show)

Shovels

From: Dingus Miltoast

If it's a climbing shovel you're after, the little BD shovel is a good way to go. I carry a big honker ava shovel, but it's too big for a climbing pack and too heavy.

I'd go with the lightest "full strength" (whatever that means in the shovel world) shovel I could find. If ski/snow camping is your goal, a larger shovel is better than a small all other things being equal. If you're climbing and digging snow caves, a smaller shovel is the ticket.

From: Keith Jewell

I'm certainly no expert, and can't really say about long term durability between aluminum and lexan. I've abused my lexan for a couple of years, and it's held up even in concrete snow. I don't think one shovel can do it all. A minimum of two, one light and small that you hope you never use for avalanche burial, and one bigger, heavier workhorse for moving lots of snow for caves and such.

From: Mike Garrison

I'd suggest aluminum over lexan both for reasons of breaking strength and sharpness when trying to break through a crust layer.

You can only lift so much snow at once, so the really big blades are maybe not worth the extra weight. I suppose it depends on how dense your snow usually is.

The extending handle is worth the extra weight.

I like the D handle.

If you do winter camping, almost all of the use is going to be digging out tent platforms, snow caves, etc., so it should be optimized for that but still workable as an avy shovel.

From: Greg Kneser

I've taken 3 avalanche seminars, but never dealt with one myelf and I've built igloos, snowcaves, and snow-trenches with snowblock covers as snow shelters during winter camping trips of various sorts.

If an avalanche dig-out is a definite possibility in your future, I would recommend an aluminum shovel as that was the recommendation from the classes. The conventional wisdom was that the lexan shovels skid across the top and don't bite into the hardpack of an avalanche debris pile.

I prefer a D handle since I like to wear mittens. If you wear gloves, a D works as well, but not vice versa (T works fine with gloves, but poorly with mittens).

Extensible shafts are nice for most any kind of digging where you might spend some time standing up.

A saw or any other tool that fits inside the handle seems like a handy tool, though I've never seen these and if it prevents the extension, then it might be best to carry separate tools.

For digging a huge hotel sized snow cave, a grain scoop is a nice shovel to have along, but not necessary for most uses.

I liked using a small lexan shovel of a friend on a trip once to dig out the tunnel into our cave because it hand an option of folding the blade over at a 90degree from the shaft. It was easier to hack away in a small space. The big shovels can be cumbersome in a tight beginning of a cave.

The points others have made about deciding on your priorities and intended uses are good. To counter the idea that you can get too large of a blade, I have one last good little trick I learned after bending a blade: tie some 3mm accessory cord to the two small holes in the end of the blade on the shovel. The loop should go from one hole to the other and be maybe 4 feet long. You can put one hand on the handle of the shovel and use the other hand on the loop and scoop out LARGE amounts of snow with relative ease while standing up comfortably. It makes shoveling easier and places less strain on the shovel.

Beacons

From: John Brynes

Actually, practicing with multiple searchers finding multiple beacons simultaneously is more realistic. The politics can be as confusing/time consuming as reading the beacons. Practice with earplugs in your ears (to simulate a bad wind when you can't hear the beeper well). A class is needed.

And finally, the best advice: If you get to a point during the search that you're confused as to where to go, just move in any direction, and the way will become clear.

Avalanche Beacon Review 2000 from Colorado Firstrax

The Truth About Digital and Analog Avalanche Beacons from Couloir Magazine

Product Reviews - Transceivers from OutdoorReview.com

Dogs

From: John Byrnes

Unless the dog is part of your group, it'll be doing body recovery.

That being said, Jon is right. Avalanche dogs are the most effective search "device".

Introduction to Avalanche Rescue Dogs by Kim Gilmore

Avalanche Dogs from Dan Comden

Conditions

US

Northwest Weather and Avalanche Center (Washington and northern Oregon)
Western Canada Avalanche Bulletins
Colorado Avalanche Information Center
Tuckerman and Huntington Ravines (Mt. Washington)
Central Sierra Current Avalanche Bulletin
Idaho Panhandle Avalanche Center
Glacier Country Avalanche Center (northwest Montana)
Mt. Shasta Wilderness Avalanche and Climbing Advisory
West Central Montana Avalanche Center
Bridger-Teton National Forest Backcountry Avalanche Hazard & Weather Forecast (Wyoming)
Bear River Avalanche Information Center (northern Utah and southeastern Idaho)
Gallatin National Forest Avalanche Center (Bozeman, Montana)
Utah Avalanche Center (northern Utah)
The Manti-La Sal National Forest (southern Utah)
Sun Valley Avalanche Center (Ketchum, Idaho)

Outside the US

SportScotland Avalanche Information Service
European Avalanche Services
Risques d'avalanches sur les Massifs montagneux de France

Most of the information in this FAQ was originally posted on rec.climbing. If you would prefer to have something attributed to you removed from this FAQ, please contact us.

Proceeds from Tradgirl.com benefit The American Safe Climbing Association